but i think judge kessler's order stands. i think it will be the law and i think tobacco will have to do that to remedy what they've done. >> speaking about big tobacco, obviously, philip morris usa did issue a statement. they're going to be studying the judge's decision. they say "we're reviewing the judge's ruling and considering next steps." that is a spokesman. you know, what recourse do the tobacco companies have specifically, avery, because they -- there's a lot of evidence that shows that everything that they were marketing was simply not true. >> the substantial evidence, the essential argument that tobacco is going to advance, deb, is simply that judge kessler abused her authority. she went too far, that a federal district court's remedial powers don't go that far. i think the court of appeals has to affirm judge kessler because indeed that's exactly what federal district judges are supposed to do. >> okay. so we're going to change gears here a little bit. we want to talk about a transgender fifth grader. for those w